Fighting for our Civil Rights // A conversation with attorney Avi Schick about the recent federal civil rights complaint filed on behalf of New York’s chasidic yeshivos

Unfortunately, we’re talking about the yeshivos again. Do you think you’ll ever get a break?
Many years ago, my father, z”l, told me, “If you decide to keep yourself busy with klal Yisrael’s challenges, you’ll never be bored.”

That’s an understatement. What prompted this latest move?
It was prompted by an accumulation of actions by the city and the state, each of which targets the yeshivos for unfair treatment. Together, they pervade every aspect of yeshivah education.

You’re suing both the city and the state?
It’s not a lawsuit, it’s a civil rights complaint that was submitted to the federal government—the United States Department of Education—which has an Office of Civil Rights (OCR). The DOE has jurisdiction over any entity that receives federal education funds, which includes school districts like the State Education Department and the New York City Department of Education. They’re both subjects of the complaint.

Hasn’t President Trump said that he’s abolishing the Department of Education? If so, what will happen to the OCR, and how will that affect this case?
The president has nominated a veteran of his first administration to serve as secretary of education. Her confirmation hearings should begin in a few weeks, so right now it’s still a functioning federal agency with thousands of employees, a budget of several hundred billion dollars and a lot of statutory authority.

In essence, you’re complaining to a federal agency about the city and the state.
Correct. They’ll have to provide their responses to the federal government. Many people in our community are familiar with this process as it relates to higher education, as it is one of the ways to fight discrimination on the college level. Even before October 7—and certainly since then—that has been the go-to address for redress for discriminatory treatment.
In the first Trump administration, the OCR was a very welcoming place. It was run by Ken Marcus, who brought leadership and energy to that office. It did a lot to protect the rights of those who were discriminated against.

Let’s say that you’re denied the relief you are seeking. How does the process of appeal work?
At this stage, let’s focus on achieving positive results, meaning that the federal government pushes the city and state to stop their unfair treatment of yeshivos.

There’s a line in the complaint that says, “In an era when the gulf between society’s values and those promoted by Jewish schools is getting wider and tolerance for differences is getting narrower, only the federal government can ensure that yeshivos can pursue their missions free from local government interference.” That’s also true with regard to the liberal mindset of the city and state of New York as opposed to the more right-leaning federal government.
There’s no doubt about that. What we are seeing in New York is an effort to impose a liberal philosophy on a traditional way of life. A strong feature of frum life in general and certainly of chasidic life is the retention of the values, tradition and culture of previous generations. By contrast, the approach of modern society is to evolve. The more modern society changes and the more we stay the same, the greater the divide between us. We are also living at a time when there is no longer a tolerance for differences. The combination of those two factors creates many challenges for us.
Many members of our community are familiar with the Yoder decision by the United States Supreme Court that protected the Amish way of life. There’s a line in that decision that I think speaks perfectly to chasidic life in New York today even though it was written 50 years ago. It discusses a mode of life that “has thus come into conflict increasingly with requirements of contemporary society exerting a hydraulic insistence on conformity to majoritarian standards.” In other words, there is tremendous pressure to conform. What the state and city are trying to do is to standardize the yeshivos. Of course, if you standardize our schools you are secularizing them.